马斯克 2022 解读 Starship 与 Starbase 最新进展

0:00Hi, it's me, Tim Dodd, the Everyday Astronaut. Welcome to Starbase, Texas. Today, we're going

0:05inside Starbase with the Ultimate Tour Guide, Elon Musk. He's going to take us through the

0:09high bay to see where Starships are assembled. We'll also see the new Mega Bay under construction

0:14and talk about SpaceX's plans to get this rocket flying. Now, I must warn you, some of the things

0:18we talk about are pretty technical, but I've got a handful of videos to help you understand

0:23what we're talking about. There's links in the description to those videos. And stick around,

0:26because in the next videos we're going to go up the launch tower, then we'll see the new Raptor 2's up close and personal,

0:32and talk about the Falcon 9's Merlin engine in great detail.

0:36And if you happen to find this video valuable, consider dropping a super thanks as a tip,

0:40or become a channel member, or a Patreon supporter, for early access and to help show your support.

0:45Alright, let's get started.

0:46So we're making good progress with the Mega Bay over there.

1:02So that should be done in a month or so.

1:05That's tricky the scale from perspective wise right here it almost looks the same you know

1:14just from our perspective but it's about 30, 40 feet taller.

1:21Okay.

1:22So it's more about just this case.

1:27So Girth is more important than Langley.

1:31because we just need, we need to be able to construct more ships and boosters.

1:37And you can see like the high bay there is, it's okay if you've got like maybe two or

1:43three works in progress, but like you like maybe have two or three workstations in this,

1:52in the high bay.

1:53In the mega bay we can have like really almost a dozen, maybe at least ten workstations.

2:00So that's why the sort of with the length are more important there.

2:05Especially as we try to really get the production line going, we need more workstations.

2:13The high bay here is okay for making for a low production rate, but as you go to a higher production rate, you just need more workstations.

2:21Yeah.

2:28And so that's booster, right?

2:31Yeah.

2:33Or half a booster, half a ship it looks like.

2:38Yeah, exactly.

2:39It looks like you do have those, your vents there, the cold gas or the, the foliage gas

2:47vents?

2:48Yeah.

2:49Well, we're using the allage gas for attitude control.

2:51So instead of having separate attitude control thrusters, we're using the allage gas itself

2:57for attitude or reaction control.

3:00So basically for attitude control

3:02in, once you're in orbit,

3:06or basically when you're in a vacuum,

3:08you don't meet, the impulse needed is very low.

3:11So, in earlier design iterations,

3:15we had a separate cold gas attitude control system

3:20with nitrogen bottles,

3:21but that actually doesn't make a lot of sense

3:23since we've got a bunch of olives

3:24that we're gonna vent anyway.

3:26So might as well use the alleged gas for basically

3:34attitude control and small delta V changes on OVID.

3:37Yeah.

3:39Okay, I had to admit,

3:40I'm you taught us to question your constraints.

3:43So that makes sense to me for the booster,

3:47because the booster doesn't need to do,

3:49basically the second you turn the engines off,

3:51it's gonna need to want to vent a lot of its stuff anyway.

3:54And that's also corresponds with its first flip.

3:56But for a starship, like with docking maneuvers and stuff,

3:59how is, to me, in my head, the Venn diagram

4:02of needing to depress a tank and the Venn diagram

4:06needed to do a orbital maneuver

4:08don't always have a huge amount of overlap.

4:11So is, or is it not a concern?

4:14Is it always going to be on tap?

4:16When the ship gets to orbit, you're

4:20going to have still pretty high pressure

4:22in the oxen fuel tanks, which are autogenously pressurized.

4:27So you've got a hot gas disoxction and hot methane.

4:35And you have a lot more all this pressure.

4:41You actually don't need any more all this pressure.

4:45So you've got more pressure than you need.

4:48OK.

4:49and the deal a bit and the landing burns

4:54are done with the header tanks.

4:56So you actually wanna vent the main tanks down

4:58to just above atmospheric pressure.

5:00Well, really,

5:06you wanna have enough pressure in the main tanks

5:08for structural stability.

5:10So it's pressure stabilized,

5:15but not any more pressure than is needed

5:17for pressure stabilization for atmospheric entry.

5:20Right.

5:21And it's going to, but when it gets to orbit,

5:24it's going to have really a lot more pressure

5:26than is needed for atmospheric entry.

5:28So we would, in any case, end up venting the main tanks

5:34down to the pressure needed for reentry.

5:39And so we'd retossing that gas away.

5:42OK.

5:43So if it's free, you might as well use it.

5:46Yeah, we're going to dump the gas anyway.

5:47So then why have separate tanks and everything?

5:51You might as well use that gas for attitude control

5:56and small maneuvers.

5:57And then even then, we'll still end up

6:03dumping the remaining gas that's not needed for entry.

6:08OK.

6:08So because of that last statement,

6:11you'll be dumping it anyway.

6:12Definitely kind of.

6:14Yeah, actually, when you look at the old design,

6:15It's just like obviously it was pretty dumb to have a separate called gas reaction control

6:24system because we have excess, allaged gas.

6:33And if we simply have a main tank vents that vent in the direction that you'd want, then

6:43and there's no need to have separate other structures.

6:47You can literally just use the vent.

6:50So at some point, those will probably

6:51have almost an Apollo style four-way set of nozzles

6:57or something, right?

6:58Or because right now they're just facing pro-grade, basically.

7:04Yeah.

7:05So that would be for settling thrusters, basically,

7:08those ones up there.

7:10and there's this side thrusters that you don't see on right now that will be added.

7:14So side vents.

7:18And yeah.

7:22So it just still surprises me that they're not doing, you know, like capturing and doing

7:28some kind of high pressure or higher pressure, you know, hot gas thruster anymore when you have.

7:32No. The hot gas thruster was definitely over-engineered and unnecessary.

7:37So, just using all his guests for, for basically for for small thrust is the obvious move in

7:48this case.

7:49So, in retrospect, the obvious move.

7:53It's much more efficient than having separate cold gas thrusters.

7:57Well, guess not, not think about it.

7:58There's probably hasn't, there's never really been a rocket where the upper stage or the actual

8:02spacecraft is 99% of giant empty tank or a drained tank.

8:07Every other vehicle, space shuttle,

8:09very small amounts of just the ohms pods,

8:12basically, that stuff.

8:14But there's never really been a vehicle that's on orbit

8:17where it just went through a four or five minute burn.

8:21And now it needs to, yeah, that actually is

8:24really, really interesting.

8:27That's so crazy.

8:28So it's a significant optimization,

8:30mass and cost savings to use the ELLage Gas for

8:34attitude and reaction control that have separate cold gas

8:39trusters.

8:40I love it.

8:42I'd say that's like one of the biggest improvements that we've

8:44made.

8:45I got to admit that was one of you.

8:47We're talking about the last time.

8:47And I kept thinking about it.

8:49Actually, it was literally a curt to me in real time.

8:53It occurred to me while I was explaining it to you.

8:55I was like, wait, what are we doing?

8:59It was one of those things that kept just being like,

9:01that can't be right.

9:02But yeah, I mean, it is, it seems to be.

9:07Yeah.

9:10We kind of went through this exercise for the ship

9:14and then it was like, wait a second,

9:14we should do that for the booster as well.

9:16And that just occurred to me literally

9:18while I was doing the interview with you.

9:19Like, okay.

9:23Do you mind saying a few things or, or do I?

9:25What do you think we should discuss?

9:28I don't know.

9:29Yeah, I wanna see Elon's interviewing skills.

9:32Well, I mean, so this is Joe Petrolaco.

9:37He's head of a booster engineering.

9:42And I don't know if anything you want to say.

9:46Like, good point of things and describe.

9:49What's new on like seven and stuff?

9:51What are some of the new things you guys are working on?

9:53On booster seven, which is down at the pad right now,

9:56it's been quite an improvement over the first boosters

9:59So we built four and five.

10:01We simplified a lot of things.

10:03Like there was a lot of,

10:03you just learn when you put things together

10:05the first time we were able to get rid of a lot of it

10:08and combine a lot of it.

10:09It's got some new arrow features.

10:10So it's got upgraded grid fins and it has chines

10:13or strakes on the side of it.

10:14And those are gonna make the reentry performance much better.

10:17So we'll be able to actually come in at a lower velocity

10:20and get a higher precision when we're coming in

10:21to the tower catch.

10:22So we're really excited to try that out.

10:24Okay.

10:25Then I got one for both of you guys.

10:27Why are the strakes or whatever?

10:29What are the chimes?

10:31Chimes?

10:31Why aren't they 180?

10:32It sounds like wind chimes.

10:34It's just the chimes.

10:35It's just the chimes.

10:36It's just the chimes.

10:37Why aren't they 180 degrees to each other?

10:40It looks like they're about 140 or something offset.

10:42Yeah, they're about 120, actually.

10:45What they do, it's not about just increasing the wingspan,

10:49if you will.

10:50It's about getting the area of the cylinder of the rocket

10:53to pressurize.

10:54So those features help the rest of the rocket pressurized.

10:57So it's more than just the area of those chimes.

10:59You actually get more net drag on that section of the vehicle.

11:03At an angle, right?

11:04Not.

11:04Yeah.

11:05OK.

11:05So you're basically using that to increase the overall surface

11:09area when it's coming at some kind of angle of attack.

11:12So the booster is very, it's very bottom heavy

11:16with all of the engines down there.

11:17And so you're trying to actually add drag area down there as well.

11:20And when you do that, that can let the booster pitch up higher.

11:24Otherwise, if you don't have the chance,

11:25it wants to just come in first.

11:28So we're going to come in pretty button first.

11:30It's going to come in slightly less.

11:32Well, you can pitch it up 120 degrees.

11:34Yeah.

11:34You can get much more control authority.

11:36And further, and it's a little bit more than just increasing

11:40the cross-section of the vehicle.

11:43Because you're not coming in.

11:45The integrated pressure profile on the base.

11:48So you've got the sort of the experienced wind

11:56of is hitting the cylinder of the vehicle

12:00and then it's rolling around the cylinder

12:01and it's kind of like losing pressure as it rolls around.

12:06By having the chines be not 180 degrees

12:11but a little lower down, we're catching more of that air

12:14that's escaping.

12:15And so technically you actually have slightly less

12:20cross-sectional area, but you have more

12:21integrative pressure at the base.

12:24Gotcha.

12:24Let's keep moving quick while this machinery's firing up.

12:27But these are very primitive chines.

12:29Yeah.

12:30We've got first attempt and not expect to change them

12:32a lot over time.

12:33Well, one of the things that I love about it

12:35is that you're covering up the COPVs.

12:37So it's both a COPV arrow cover.

12:40Double use out of it.

12:40Double use out of it, which I love.

12:43I do fear that it makes us less rigorous

12:45about getting rid of COPVs.

12:48But more complacent that they're have a home.

12:50It's as many as we wanted under them.

12:52So they were still a person.

12:53Okay, good.

12:55But like if you say like what's,

12:57what are optimized chines,

12:58you'd actually want them to get bigger as you get.

13:01Wider at the bottom.

13:02Yeah, wider at the bottom.

13:03It begins to start looking like chip flaps.

13:05Yeah. Yeah.

13:06You can put the simulation right away.

13:07Especially as you're coming in,

13:09like you said with such a big amount of mass

13:11and basically a dry can above it,

13:13you'd really want the center of pressure

13:14to be as low as possible.

13:16Right.

13:18So that brings me to another question then.

13:20I'm curious why you guys are still sticking with grid fins

13:23instead of more traditional stabilator or some kind of conard

13:27or something.

13:30Well, this is a frequent topic of an conversation.

13:32Exactly.

13:34We discussed this a lot.

13:35I mean, essentially, our optimization right now

13:39is getting to a little bit.

13:41So there's a, yeah, so we know how to use grid fins

13:47from Falcon 9.

13:50Grid fins are much more consistent than flaps

13:55as you go from hypersonic to super sonic

13:58to trans sonic to subsonic.

13:59So you're going through these different markers

14:00regimes and grid fins are much more consistent

14:05than a wing or a wingy thing.

14:08Yeah.

14:09So, especially as you go subsonic, the center of pressure on any kind of flat surface shifts

14:18significantly when you go from supersonic to subsonic.

14:23So, but I, you know, could you be lighter than a Gritfen?

14:31I think there's a good chance you could be.

14:34There's also another factor which is the actuator power needed to turn a grid fin is much less

14:40than is needed for to turn a wing, a sort of a wing like thing.

14:44Similar.

14:45Yeah.

14:46Especially as that center of pressure changes.

14:49It increases the torque on the motor, right?

14:51You're necessarily going to be ordered so short that even if the center of pressure changes,

14:57it's not far from the rotation point.

14:59And so the total pork required does not change dramatically throughout your mock-breaking transitions.

15:05Yeah, yeah.

15:06We are constantly talking about can we have the right number of grid-

15:09Like for-

15:09They designed correctly.

15:10Yes, so like we're not saying we're right to be clear.

15:13Like we're definitely not optimal, but we, it'll work.

15:19Yeah.

15:20Like it's probably, we're working as good and it's one less problem to solve.

15:26It's also like we obviously don't need four.

15:34I think we could probably get away with two.

15:38Definitely not more than three.

15:40Well, you're old 2016 original OG ITS had three,

15:45and I remember that being a pretty unique design consideration.

15:49There's a number of iterations that this vehicle has gone through is insane.

15:52Before it even hit the pavement, it already iterated like...

15:55So many times.

15:57Well, I started questioning, you know, why, for me,

16:00I always thought the grid fin was a lot of it was being able

16:03to retract him on a cent, you know, get him out of the

16:04wind stream, but now that you're not retracting him,

16:07I was like, well, that and then also, you know,

16:09the actual mass savings, you know, 50% of your,

16:12the mass of a grid fin is perpendicular to your control

16:16motion, you know, your control authority.

16:18So I always wondered if like they, how that would,

16:21the trade would be on just, yeah, compared like

16:23normal wingy thing. If you know your position well and you know your wind's well, you can in theory

16:33have a ballistic arc when you do your boost back burn that is very accurate with nothing.

16:41Except, and we tried this in the early days of Falcon 9, but the problem is like

16:49Like any small asymmetries on the vehicle

16:55will cause it to go crazy, basically.

16:59It'll spin up and start flapping around

17:01and it'll just start oscillating and rotating.

17:04And.

17:05And.

17:06And.

17:07Yeah.

17:08Exactly.

17:09So technically you don't actually need massive surfaces.

17:14You just need to be able to take out the asymmetries

17:18of the, of perturbances on the vehicle,

17:23and any error that you have with respect to position

17:27or your boost back impulse.

17:29Yeah.

17:30And even wind conditions and things like that

17:31after a micro.

17:32Yeah.

17:33So you really don't,

17:36the control surfaces you need are actually not very big.

17:39And we've shrunk the grid fins significantly

17:42from where we started out.

17:44So they're much lighter.

17:48Yeah, but even with grid fins, we really should be moving to aspirationally two grid fins,

17:57but certainly not more than three.

18:00And the third one can be small.

18:02A little vestigial guy, and I like just imagining a tiny little guy.

18:06And I'm one sector.

18:09So, I think we have actually this is liquid oxygen tank section for booster 8.

18:20It's coming along very quickly right behind booster 7 and then the ship 24 nose comes.

18:25So this is the ship that we hope to bear with booster 7 for our first orbital launch.

18:34It's looking so much more refined already than even S20.

18:41Oh, can we see the door?

18:46On the back side of it?

18:47Corner.

18:48I mean, it's like a blow your mind.

18:51You'd be surprised, man.

18:52The internet sure loves that door.

18:55Yeah, you got to see the door anyway, so I guess why not.

18:57But because you're at this point planning

19:03to launch 24 with Starlink version 2 already, right?

19:12Yeah.

19:13Well, we'll see.

19:16But, I mean, it's just, like I said,

19:24it's not gonna blow your mind here, yeah.

19:27It's basically, it's like we call it the PES dispenser.

19:31Yeah.

19:32And it's kind of like that.

19:33It's the stalling satellites are, you know,

19:37in this rack, which looks like a friggin' PES thing.

19:43Cause they're like, you know, kind of like rectangular,

19:45just like a PES.

19:46and they're stacked inside the nose cone, inside the bearing.

19:51And since they're low profile, we only

19:56need really a small door.

19:59With a small door, we can use pressure stabilization.

20:02Like, we're going to retain pressure in the bearing.

20:05So we can, at least partially, pressure stabilize the nose cone.

20:10Oh, fairing.

20:12And then we don't have a humongous hinged door.

20:19But might later on, which larger pieces of cargo

20:22and things like that.

20:23Yeah, we can make a giant door in the future.

20:25But this, a small door always,

20:28a lot less than a giant door.

20:29Yeah, yeah.

20:31I would say, for a sense, that we could come up like third.

20:33Yeah, I feel like it just begs the camera.

20:36It's going wrong, we clear.

20:37Yeah, if the mechanisms inside jam up,

20:40that'll be pretty embarrassing.

20:41Right, right.

20:43But it looks like it's just begging to have

20:44like two big googly eyes with a funny looking grin there,

20:48you know, or something.

20:50So we are incurring some complexity

20:54for the sort of the racking system inside,

20:57because you've got to have a racking system.

21:00So it's more complicated than a pessus pesser.

21:03But it's the general principle, is it

21:04like spring loaded then or hydraulic loaded or something?

21:07It's a bunch of electric, it's electric.

21:15And with a bunch of mechanisms.

21:21And they just like roll themselves out

21:22and just zip out the door and...

21:26Sorry.

21:27It's inspired by pallet stacking technology.

21:29Yes, like I watch YouTube videos of a pallet stacker.

21:32Exactly, exactly.

21:33And industrial pallet stackers is the same basic principle.

21:37They don't look super simple, but they do work.

21:44And so it's the same basic mechanism.

21:47I mean, there's some risk of,

21:50you're loading it in at one G

21:54and then you're unloading it at zero G.

21:56So you could have some situation

22:00where you're unloading a mechanism

22:02and because you unload the mechanism, it now binds.

22:05So that's the risk that we best hard to test for.

22:08Yes.

22:08Yeah.

22:09Yeah.

22:10What?

22:11So you're planning to actually do your first set

22:14of Starlink version 2s on this vehicle?

22:19Or wait, is this 25 or 24?

22:22Is this 24?

22:23Which is currently scheduled-ish to be the first orbital

22:26attempt, right?

22:28So you are.

22:29So has the plan changed to go from kind of a suborbital

22:32to an orbital launch if you're going

22:34to be trying to pop out a couple star links.

22:36No, we're always going to go here.

22:38Our next launch is always going to be orbital.

22:42Full orbital, not?

22:43Yes.

22:44OK.

22:44So that would?

22:45Well, yes.

22:46I mean, yes.

22:47Well, cool.

22:48OK.

22:48Because for a little while, there's talk about B4 and stuff,

22:51and that's pointing back in the day doing like a just shy

22:53of orbit on the re-entered by Hawaii and stuff like that,

22:56never quite reaching.

22:57It's basically orbit.

22:59OK, yeah.

22:59There's no real difference.

23:00Mouse fart between them.

23:01Yeah, I mean, you could just, it's the difference between,

23:05I mean, you're going like three quarters

23:07the way around the earth.

23:09Yeah, I mean, you could.

23:10Was literally like 30 meters per second difference.

23:12So it's a layer is as small.

23:14Yeah, it's essentially over the last C.

23:18So there's just no point in doing,

23:21like why not, why do an extra loop around the earth,

23:24and have another, the overgrown.

23:27So.

23:28But really, I wouldn't say that there's like,

23:34high confidence that the first flight will work.

23:36I think there's a good chance that it does not reach

23:38orbits, that there's an issue with the booster

23:40or stage separation or what the ship doesn't start or,

23:45and then even if it does get to orbits,

23:46there's probably that the ship makes it down in tact

23:50is also not super high.

23:53This is why it's entering over the Pacific

23:56an unpopulated area. So if there is an issue, it's not a danger to people.

24:02Yeah. So one of the things that a lot of people were asking about after, once we started seeing

24:09the heat shield tiles, is why they aren't scaled like a dragon or like a rough shingle where they're

24:14slightly overlapping and tapering and thickness. You know, why are they just have the gaps and

24:20everything. I mean, you know, there's multiple ways to approach this. So it's not that like

24:32a single approach, it couldn't work. You could have a single approach. The thing that will

24:40happen or should in theory happen here is that when the tiles get hot, they will expand and

24:46tighten the gap. So the gaps that you see here should be smaller when the tiles heat up.

24:55And you know, you're really not gonna see a lot of heat going down through those gaps is our expectation.

25:07So, shingling does not seem to be important.

25:12You could be wrong about that.

25:14So, it's kind of a ramen vehicle.

25:15Yeah.

25:16It's close to trying to burn.

25:17Right, right.

25:18Yeah, the flow is not coming straight in at those gaps.

25:22It's like...

25:23It's, yeah, I mean we'll be coming in at an angle

25:27similar to the shuttle, like, I don't know,

25:2967 degrees.

25:30So sort of like, if the ground is the surface of the earth,

25:34we're sort of coming in like that.

25:35Yeah.

25:37And it's a balance between generating lift.

25:41Like, for a reusable heat shield,

25:44we want to minimize the peak heat load.

25:46So the peak heat load is going to determine if we melt

25:49the tiles or not.

25:50And if you melt the tiles, they're not very good for reuse.

25:52So we're kind of balancing between generating lift.

26:01And yeah, so there's atmospheric density, velocity,

26:08and you don't wanna have like,

26:12be going fast in high density air.

26:16That's gonna be.

26:17You wanna kind of stay up in the upper atmosphere

26:18for a little bit longer than you would.

26:20You wanna slow down as much as possible

26:22in the thin upper atmosphere.

26:25So you minimize peak heating.

26:28That's the best goal.

26:29Minimize peak heating.

26:30Which is pretty much what designed

26:31the whole shuttle's airframe almost was that peak heating

26:34and controlling that peak, that peak queue.

26:39Yes, so we're gonna learn a lot from this first entry.

26:46I like said, if there's any issues,

26:52the ship will not, you know, if there's unexpected heating in some places, then the ship will

26:57fail on entry and it'll be that.

27:01Yeah.

27:02Is there any talks, speaking of failing and re-entry and all those things?

27:08And we guys, there were rumblings for a little bit, you guys, someone was talking about flying

27:13ship 20 still, or S20.

27:14Just on a sub-orbital.

27:15Yeah, we've moved on.

27:17,

27:34We think we've learned, you know, what we need to learn really with the cybervital flights.

27:39And there wasn't really much to learn, so best of folks aren't getting too old.

27:43Okay.

27:44I mean, yay, but also, I don't know.

27:47I'm quite excited about that.

27:49Yes, true.

27:50Yeah, those 33 rappers I think will put on a pretty, that'll make up for the slow,

27:54slow gentle climb will be 33 shaking everything.

27:57I think what it will seem pretty pretty odd or like strange is that the Starship orbital

28:06stack is going to come off the pad very fast.

28:08Yeah.

28:09So yeah, it's got a high thrust weight.

28:11What's its best approximate thrust weight?

28:13I mean it should be like 1.4, maybe 1.5.

28:16Yeah.

28:17That's like already on five speeds because SRB's, once that, those lights, that thing

28:22just shot off, shoots off the pad, you know?

28:25Yeah.

28:26be like that. I mean it's yeah. I'm

28:31being disoriented to see something that big just accelerating that quickly you

28:35know it'll. For a reusable vehicle you actually want to have a higher thrust to

28:39weight than an expendable vehicle because thrust weight below one is not

28:44doing anything. So your propellant is not being useful below thrust weight of one

28:49so you actually want to have a higher thrust to weight for a reusable vehicle

28:55than for an expendable.

28:57For an expendable vehicle, the cost overwhelmingly

29:00is in the vehicle itself that you are losing.

29:04But for a reusable vehicle, if it's rapidly

29:09reusable and completely reusable,

29:11the cost of propellant is the single biggest cost

29:14of the flight.

29:15And so you want to have a high thrust

29:16to wait so that more of the thrust is useful.

29:20Yeah.

29:21So high thrust to wait, Rachel, literally

29:24is financially beneficial purely on the,

29:28you need less fuel to do the same kind of work.

29:30Like this may sound sort of mercantile,

29:33but it's actually the thing to optimize for

29:36is cost per ton to orbit.

29:42Like you can't cheat if you get cost per ton to orbit.

29:48It's not about what the mass ratio is or the ISP

29:53or anything. So although we're aiming to have a great match ratio, a great ISP, everything,

29:57but it's really what is your fully considered cost per ton to orbit.

30:01At the end of the day, yes, the fully considered cost per ton to orbit is the optimization.

30:06And any given technology is only relevant to the degree that it produces cost per ton to orbit.

30:11So thrust-to-weight ratio might matter more than ISP as long as it makes for a lower cost per ton to orbit.

30:19Yes.

30:20So the trade offs always end up with, does it decrease the cost per ton to orbit?

30:26And that's what matters more than it.

30:27That's racially, we don't always get right, but the thing that really matters is minimize

30:32cost per ton to orbit.

30:34And then for Mars or the moon, minimize cost per ton to the surface of the moon or to the

30:40surface of Mars.

30:42And just to give you a sense of just how much we need to improve it, it's really insane.

30:49Like right now the cost per useful landed ton to serve some Mars is inaccessible a billion dollars.

30:59So you can't count the heat shield or the parachute or the useful stuff.

31:04So the landing system's mass does not count.

31:07Only the, like in the case of the rovers,

31:12it's really just the rover that is the useful thing.

31:16So if the rover weighs a ton,

31:19then it costs a billion dollars to get there.

31:23It's a billion dollars per ton to Mars.

31:29And that's roughly what it currently costs.

31:34Now in order to make life multi-planetary and have a self-sustaining city on Mars, that

31:44number will have to improve to I think probably under $100,000 a ton.

31:53That would be a 10,000 times better than the current state of the art.

31:57To put this into perspective, how much of an improvement is needed?

32:01About 10,000 percent, 10,000 fold.

32:05That's what Starship is intended to do.

32:11Be 10,000 times better than the current state of the art.

32:17So, orders and orders and orders of magnitude.

32:20A lot of orders of magnitude.

32:22But it is, we're not breaking any laws of physics.

32:26It is possible to do that.

32:28Can we see up at the top or is there anything to see up there right now?

32:32now. Not really anything to see. I mean, I think we probably shouldn't take pictures of the inside.

32:40Not that it's super interesting, but I think we're going to be cautious about like pictures

32:47of the inside of so. Where's the lifting points on this one now? You can see the lugs up there.

33:14I mean, we need to move those lifting points. Those are out in a good position.

33:19So you don't want to have lifting points where the heat shield tiles are.

33:24We need to move the lift points to where the heat shield tiles are not.

33:29Are you still hoping to catch the ship too with the arms or what's the...

33:35I mean you are right?

33:36Yeah.

33:37How are you going to catch it I guess?

33:40Are you going to do the same thing with the tiny little lumps?

33:44Like the booster?

33:46Yeah, I mean it'll be very similar to the booster with

33:51In the case of the ship because we need to have huge hill tiles that go more than 180 degrees a little more than 180 degrees

33:58We'll have to have the

34:00Catch points kind of flip out

34:03But it'll otherwise be in the in the lead way the win

34:09Like you'd have to I mean this you'd have to have a part with he chills house pop out or

34:14or have something that's in the leeward side that swings out.

34:17One of the two.

34:18And you can't just have the,

34:20you can't catch them by the nose fins.

34:24You will sort of could,

34:32well, like what you're seeing there

34:34that doesn't have heat shield tiles

34:36will need to have heat shield tiles.

34:37Yeah, yeah.

34:38So everything's gonna have heat shield tiles.

34:40Just, you see a steel part at the base of the,

34:43but that'll have to have tiles on it.

34:45If it's attached, if the mounting point would be attached to somewhere on the leeward side of the flap,

34:50and the flap could rotate more than 180 degrees, it could get in line with this.

34:54It could be the same mechanism that does the quickie thing, could be just the flap itself.

35:02I'm not sure I understand what you're saying, but...

35:05If the catch ball thing is on the leeward side of the flap,

35:10and the flap can go beyond 180 degrees...

35:13Oh, that's... man.

35:14There's not the problem you want us to try solve.

35:17The huge challenge we have is the hot gas seal.

35:22Oh, right. You'd move that in the morning.

35:25Over center of that.

35:26Yes.

35:27Like frankly, the thing we need to do, I think,

35:30is move the Ford flaps more towards the leeward side.

35:33This is a major internal debate.

35:37But there's a massive amount of optimization possible with the Ford flaps.

35:42They're in the wrong position.

35:46The wrong size, wrong position, wrong location.

35:50But they will work.

35:51Yeah, they're a start.

35:53Yeah, they'll work but they're far from optimal.

35:58What are the, under those one heap shields,

36:00you see the little, those like yellow puck things.

36:04What are those in, are those special or something?

36:06Just temperature sensors.

36:08Oh, I think so.

36:10either temperature or radio.

36:14I'm not sure.

36:15Okay.

36:16So, here are the antennas or temperature sensors?

36:22Well, what else is new since last time we were out here?

36:28Well, we're pulling the mega bay.

37:19What got you? Here's turning now.

37:23No, just this, I mean, there's a lot of improvements

37:26to make with the ship and booster design.

37:29But anyway, right now the important thing is just to get to orbit with, you know, some

37:36reasonable payload and then we have a whole series of improvements that we plan to

37:41improve the performance of the payload to orbit.

37:49But I really am not a fan of our forward claps. Like every time I look at them

37:55drives me crazy because they're so sub-optable.

37:59Well, your rate of innovation and your rate of iteration, those will be different sooner

38:05than later, I'm sure.

38:08Yeah, I mean, there's a potential scenario where we can delete the four claps entirely.

38:14And the shuttle doesn't have four claps.

38:19Right.

38:20that's because you're using dihedral control to control mostly pitch and you can still

38:27do a little bit of yawn roll with just a pair. So, huh. Because it's mostly about your center

38:39pressure, right? So, center of mass and center of pressure. It's a CISO. So you can just think

38:46of these things like the you've got a seesaw and your center of pressure like

38:58the wind the air is hitting the vehicle and you have a center of

39:07pressure it's like where's the where's that air gonna push the vehicle like

39:14If you add up all the wind pressure,

39:17where if you're pushing it with your finger,

39:21where would you, what's the center of that force gonna be?

39:26And then you've got your center of mass,

39:28which is a similar thing, but for mass.

39:32So you've got these sort of two C-saw things,

39:35center pressure, center of mass.

39:38If you have big forward flaps and big rear flaps,

39:41you can have a much more variation

39:44in where your center of fast is gonna be.

39:46And also what your angle of attack can be

39:48and how well you control the vehicle

39:50and different macho regimes

39:53and in the face of like a lot of wind shear, wind buffet.

40:01So.

40:02Because there is that, again, Soviet,

40:04like I don't remember what it's called,

40:07the mole or something

40:08that just had a dihedral wing on the back,

40:11it's supposed to be like a mini shuttle for them,

40:12like a two passenger Charon.

40:14What was that?

40:15The baron.

40:15No, not baron.

40:16No.

40:17It had like it's had foldable wings.

40:20And they basically the only thing is over those are fixed.

40:22They weren't dynamic.

40:23You know, so it's not like they controlled its pitch,

40:26but it basically had a really was supposed to have a really

40:28high angle of attack during initial ascent.

40:30And then the the back flaps just folded down.

40:33And but that was to extend basically have actual lift

40:35and do a horizontal landing.

40:37It wasn't necessarily like a dynamic link.

40:39But the idea was that you could control your overall,

40:42you know, pitch almost like, you know, virgin galactic spaceship two that folds in half, you know, how it can change its

40:49its whole center pressure and everything just, you know, in a single thing. But it's not again, that's not dynamic. It goes from one mode to

40:56mode one to mode two, you know, and same with that that Soviet one. But yeah, there's, you know, that probably becomes a lot trickier when you are trying to be dynamic and we are trying to actually

41:05pinpoint control your landing. I'm sure that

41:08it was just having a

41:09The thing that's like really counter-tutive about the Starship is that it's not an aircraft,

41:15it's falling.

41:17So we're just constantly trying to break as opposed to an aircraft that is, aircraft

41:22is trying to generate lift and fly horizontally.

41:26We are trying to generate drag and be as draggy as possible when we fall.

41:33So it's a very different optimization than an aircraft.

41:38So, yeah.

41:43It's about four times the usable area of the high bay.

41:50So it's only a little bit taller, but it's a lot wider and deeper.

41:54And so we have a lot more positions for, you may factoring the booster or the chip.

42:03So if you have a production line,

42:05you need a lot of stations, essentially,

42:07for a high production.

42:10So this is intended to have a lot of stations.

42:12Is some of this getting replaced by another building

42:15that's over top of some stuff, or is it?

42:19We are building a permanent battery building

42:22and replacing the tents.

42:27With the high bays and a one-way building.

42:29We're not building a building to encompass the high bay.

42:32That would be insane.

42:35But we're all going to be building a permanent factory

42:38building and replacing the tents.

42:40And we'll start the factory building from that side

42:42and kind of both and gradually replace the tents

42:45with a large permanent building.

42:48That's actually currently in the works, I guess.

42:51So you're still, you know, there's a lot of speculation,

42:54obviously with how quickly Florida's ramping up

42:55that this might be slowing down,

42:57but that doesn't seem to be slowing down too much

42:59if you're building a building out here.

43:01Yeah.

43:03Yeah.

43:05Hey, my, I'm Tim.

43:06Hi, Andy Krebs.

43:08Awesome.

43:09Yeah, sorry, what was your name?

43:10Andy Krebs.

43:11OK, cool.

43:11I was engineering for the non-quite hardware,

43:13so I do the high bays and factory up the spot

43:15for those who also launch the Google stage zero.

43:18A lot of the stage zero stuff.

43:19Yeah.

43:21The ground systems are, ground systems,

43:24especially inclusive of the tower,

43:26are at least as complicated as the stage one or stage two.

43:31Yeah.

43:32So should we go check out stage zero?

43:36Sure.

43:39Ha ha.

43:47Thank you, Elon, for all your generous time

43:49and thank you, Ryan Schlinski, for helping

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44:13I'm Tim Dodd, the Everyday Astronaut.

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